Episode 26 · 30:27
Why you need to prune people from your life to grow
Using a tree as the central metaphor, Dan and Tom explore why growth sometimes requires pruning relationships, habits and commitments that once belonged. Letting go creates space, but it also involves grief and judgement about what can recover.
The conversation argues for thoughtful pruning rather than dramatic clearing: protect what is healthy, remove what repeatedly drains it and allow new growth time.
The useful bits
What to take with you
- Growth can require releasing something that was once useful.
- Look for repeated patterns of depletion rather than making a decision from one difficult moment.
- A boundary may be enough; not every strained relationship requires complete removal.
- New capacity often appears only after old commitments stop consuming it.
Watch the conversation
The original episode.
Full conversation
Transcript
Transcript generated from YouTube captions. Dan/Tom speaker attribution is AI-assisted and may occasionally be incorrect.
[Music] don't believe [Music] welcome back we're triggering Order 66 for all those Star Wars lovers out there we are going to change it up this is going to be uh the last episode that you'll see in the format that we have been doing so broadly speaking we've been doing you know I don't know 20 25 minutes of English stuff then we've switched it had an ad and then we switched over to Welsh so next week we're going to do something different.
And we're basically going to add a little bit more order yeah we're gonna knock it out um so we're basically going to do a little bit more order um because as you have always known from the start of this it's been a live documentation process of this whole entire thing and we recognize now we've nailed the consistency and iteration of quality we need to iterate the quality of the actual content and the and the kind of the the structure of the content.
So typically um I always find that that last piece is the if you add a little bit of order not too much to kind of like eke it out of the creativity and spontaneity but a little bit of order gets you in that right sweet spot so we're triggering order 66. is it Order 66 yeah order 66 which means that we're going to change our mindset some for the next week hopefully there'll be something different and if there isn't.
Something different it's probably because we forgot that we've triggered Order 66 and we're going to do something different then we'll listen to it in the future and then do it in the future yeah so I've been reading I've been reading I've been watching um I've been watching this uh Ted talk again so I've watched it a couple months back but I've been watching it again um to try and come up with the talk so um I'm wanting to do more talk kind of.
Content um about purpose mindset and there's a talk by Myron golden um Myron golden and he illustrates this really good um kind of like mindset kind of like process um image and so we'll put a link in the in the description but I'll just explain it very very quickly basically he says the facts have a positive a negative frame and the reason why it has a frame is because that gives us Focus that Focus then translates into our mind.
Which basically comes into a belief you either have faith um or self-doubt oh sorry not self-doubt or doubt um faith is believing for a positive outcome that you desire and doubt is a um believing for a desire sorry believing for an outcome that you don't desire so doubt is actually a belief still right A belief in an outcome that you don't desire that then shifts into feelings so the focus goes into feelings those feelings translate into either anticipation.
Which is like um excitement for something or it translates to anxiety then once it hits the heart and the feelings it then goes into the third layer which is function if you have anticipation for something which is the feeling because you have a positive frame on a particular fact then it drives into feeling like you have power feeling like you have control over a situation feeling like a positive feeling if you have a negative frame around a fact which translates into.
Doubt which then goes into a feeling that is anxiety that translates to ultimately powerlessness so really what you want to do is you ultimately want to look at the framing that you're applying to any fact now it doesn't mean that um that the fact is is basically anything right you you've just got a letter from the bank that is a fact now the positive framing is like oh it's just an automated message they send this to everybody chasing for XYZ or.
Saying hey your paperwork is not in play or we haven't got an address for you or whatever it is or the red note right the positive framework is like hey I know that this is an automated message and if I call them and explain myself it'll all be fine right so it doesn't necessarily translate to anticipation but it gives you the sense of power right you've got power over this situation so it's not controlling you whereas if you said oh no another letter.
From the bank they're probably going to take my house like that is a negative frame on a fact which is then translating to doubt which then translates through to the feeling of anxiety which then basically makes you powerless so I found that incredibly interesting and what he um he kind of obviously goes into way more detail but broadly speaking that's the principle and he's saying that ultimately if you want to um influence somebody you want to create the feeling of anticipation because.
Anticipation then drives an action rather than creating anxiety so how can you in business decrease the sense of anxiety and increase the sense of anticipation in engaging with you you know even I guess you could take it with anything right any sort of um engagement of of friendship or or business or anything or a relationship how do you decrease the anxiety and increase the anticipation and sometimes that's about being for example a business sense you decrease the friction.
Um that it takes to to interact with you guys so like if you're like no we don't take any calls like that's a bit difficult sometimes people want to have a call just to like get something explained to them or well we only have one call not two calls you know is the kind of the rigidness which basically equates anxiety which is ultimately going to create this powerlessness vibe in them which is probably meaning that they're not going to go for it so I.
Found that incredibly incredibly interesting um and one like analogy that I'd like to not analogy sorry one symbolic action that I'd like to do is if you've thought of a fact in your mind so something that is happening or a situation that's happening right now and you take the positive something positive a positive frame and you write that down on a Post-It note and you take the negative frame and write that down on a Post-It note and basically wherever you've just.
Done that walk out the room with the positive one and put the negative one in the bin as like a symbolic nature of Smash forward yes smash it up with a hammer um don't destroy that table that you created yeah so that table that you're working on yeah and then that's the symbolic outworking of something that then can be taken to her because I think obviously we're all different types of Learners I am a little bit more that.
Kind of like Hands-On type thing as well so um that's basically a talk that I'd like to put together um and it's specifically about hey let's take this fact let's try and work out the positive framing let's try and work out the negative Framing and what did the negative frame conclude with the negative frame concluded self-doubt it concluded you know um like anxiety you know all that stuff but the positive frame will end up resulting in excitement um like a sense of control a sense of.
Ownership so like how do you navigate those two you just work on the frame so the fact is still the fact but yes that was um all hand tips to Myron golden on um his TED Talks I thought it was it was executed brilliantly it was it was really good so yeah and I've kind of like I've distilled it in so I can explain it even more succinctly kind of thing but he has added a load of extra.
Content yeah it reminds me of two things that I've seen recently ish and I guess it's the difference in between and you might be able to help me with this is you I versus ux and it's basically I saw an image and it was of a mug I'm holding a mug for those that are listening and it basically had ears because it's a picture of like a face of an animal um it had ears and they're like this.
Looks amazing but when they were drinking it they're both stabbing it in its eyes communicating the difference in between how it looks amazing but then when people use it it will then something that might look amazing and be perfect on a shelf the practicality is it stabbing you in your eyes and you might end up in hospital or whatever so it is that figuring out what works for you which is like backwards and forwards of like why did you come to that belief well.
Actually it's because I've been stubbing myself in the eyes every time I've been taking a cup of tea like that relationship has been pulling me down without even realizing it it's those types of intuition slash gut feeling flashing out with friends or family in a safe environment to figure out what works for you yeah and the similar sort of viewpoint is have you ever seen a path that's like an L shape but then there's always like a line that crosses over.
Because no one wants to walk around the corner and I think it is that it's similar to mind frame isn't it of you might have a perfect way and created a frame of your life as a kid but then as you've got older maybe people said negative thoughts or feelings over you so you're slowly cutting that corner but actually it's worth revisiting the whole way you walk around your brain and and have those sort of positive affirmations and understandings of your new self not.
Just a kid self leveled with a lot of pain misery negativity but actually remove everything pull out the kid self let it breathe it's like burying it alive knowing who you are as an adult and then walking out from that to build a new Fresh character it's about um the the path that's trodden the most typically becomes the easiest Pathway to go down right it's it takes less energy and therefore if that in Tom's analogy that like shortcut version where you're.
Walking over the grass if that's a negative thought then the more that that path has used the easier it becomes so that becomes then the new pathway rather than the long way round which is typically more so going to be a positive thought but if over time you instill the positive thought then ultimately you can reverse it where the positive thought is the easiest route and the negative thought is so difficult to comprehend and that you don't naturally go there.
Another analogy um that I've come across in the last week or so is um trees and leaves the relationship with trees and leaves the tree basically is in a mutual relationship with the leaves in the sense of um the tree gets light from or gets energy from the leaf as it converts the solar into um kind of like energy or food or whatever um to the tree and the tree therefore sucks the water from the ground and feeds it to the leaves I know that.
Leaves also catch a bit of water too but yeah predominantly the tree is getting the water to the leaves now at some point it doesn't become Mutual in the sense of through winter um the leaves could basically suck the tree dry um because obviously there's not so much sun in winter so one but there's still water so the leaves are getting what they get but the tree is not getting what it gets so it has to factually push.
The leaves off get rid of the leaves because it's not mutually benefit in that season so apply this to life are there Hobbies tasks responsibilities relationships that basically were good and mutual in one season that have now become imbalanced in this season and therefore you have to as the tree um to survive factually you have to get rid of those leaves to survive otherwise you won't survive and I think there's um the difficulty with not having an analogy like the tree and stuff it makes.
Sense right it does it it Cycles it right in the human sense I think typically we think about one letting people down to the opinions well ultimately which is the opinions of others um in that and feeling like oh we're not loyal or whatever like all those negative characteristics that we think are going to result in the fact that somebody saw that you were shedding your your coat as it were um or pushing your leaves off while you're doing it and I thought that was a.
Organic a really good analogy nature is doing it so why are we not doing it um and it doesn't mean that you kill everything and get rid of everything there's a there's a way about it but it's just encouraging you that it's okay it's a part of nature for this to happen when relationships or Dynamics become imbalanced nature kind of like corrects it you know so that's the thing is it's taken a step back and if in creating that space if it's sat in a car.
Before going to work or coming home from work or stuck in traffic skiing yourself your mind your heart your body do you have energy and if the answer is no and it's a regular no then it's recognizing you're clearly not getting watered the plants are that the hobby is or the household is or all the things that might be attached to you and Associated to you but actually the thing if the tree dies everything else won't live so it's looking at okay how can you.
Prune um those Elements of Life can you get a job closer to home because actually it's the journey that's killing you or it might be the hobby that you used to like but now you don't and you fancy a change and it's giving yourself permission to change and it's okay to try something new um and finding it fascinating looking at um Jeremy Clarkson's um Farm thing on Amazon Prime and it's fascinating just seeing I guess the realism in trying something.
New how the amount of mistakes that he's doing obviously it helps when you've got a bank balance that levels out all your vast mistakes on a cost level but actually it's going do I allow myself to fail in the areas of my life because actually if I looked at my garden could I make 20 failure that I can figure that out on a lower cost that let's say I'm wasting 10 pounds on seats or whatever or on a.
Plant pot that actually it's just worth the learning curve because actually I'm not losing I think on one of the things he was learning losing 90k which is loads but on a percentage wise let's say it's 10 but it's like okay could I loot practice learning to lose 10 for the overall growth of the 90 that might get me to somewhere else hmm I I I love I know I love examples and and analogies and stuff and I I guess a.
Lot of the time we typically think that um we have to do something that is reflective of of what we've seen but sometimes we're in a in a realm where nobody has this unique collection of ideas or thoughts or business ideas so what you specifically have been like challenged to do or called to do or or you feel inside your like gut and Instinct that you feel um like a draw or like a pull towards that might be so.
Unique that there is no reference point to like hang against so if we go back to the mindset part the mindset um is basically focusing um on a fact right with a particular frame the frame gives you this Focus which creates a belief and it creates faithful doubt now Faith to add another analogy this is a podcast of analogies today if if for example I had this seat behind me and I could not see the seat you guys watching would be able to see.
The seat and Tom would be able to see the seat well actually you probably can't because you've got your laptop right I'm looking at the camera so Faith really and if I was going to try and sit down Faith really is believing that there is a chair there right and the way that I believe that there is a chair there is the people watching will be able to tell me that there's a chair there and Tom if he was watching would be able to tell me.
That there's a chair there and then I trust in that then as I'm maneuvering I basically so yeah that's the first part right trusting is the first part but really faith is about the the action part it's the both trusting and the action so yes I trust there's a seat there but am I actually going to try and sit down on it and navigate to get down and sit on it and that is again a balance of maybe you.
Guys watching will be able to tell me a bit to the left a bit to the right so faith is about both the the trusting in what you've seen and also then using that and acting on the trust that you see now with the Jeremy Clarkson stuff it's it's difficult because yeah you're right the reference points are different so sometimes it is about trying to um trust things that are relative to your space but then other times it is absolutely in a.
Pioneering space the um there's this uh video of Pharrell Williams going into um like a critique of University students I think doing music production and he listens to this one lady's track and he's he's not saying much while the track is happening but then at the end of the track he says um I have no notes I have no notes whatsoever and the reason is because you're creating something unique so there is no comparable there is nothing to compare against so I can't give you.
Feedback if you were trying to sound like something then that would make sense oh I could give you some recommendations yeah reference points but if you're trying to AKA Pioneer um or innovate there might not be a reference point so that can be incredibly lonely an incredibly like isolating but I think so long as you know that that is an aspect of pioneering then it's okay if you think of anybody trying to discover um new territory chances are that's a.
Lonely Journey because you don't really know if there is a seat on the other end or not right um but it is a case of like kind of enjoying or engaging with the loneliness not for it to be something that you fear and have um a sense of powerlessness over but like an anticipation rather than the anxiety of like oh it's you know um it's lonely to Pioneer you know there's a positive frame to that and there's a.
Negative frame to that right or the Journey of pioneering yeah that makes sense so what are we summarizing with to keep it short and snappy for people out there well you could you can summarize it because I I um yeah I think it's just take your time you don't need to chop everything out because there might be baggage on the process of that um but actually if it's easier get a piece of paper write everything down write what physical links to it if it's.
A sport or it might be driving or whatever what is a mental how much you have to think about it maybe it's stress or maybe a a weak area that's finances and you constantly talking about finances and literally write it out figure out what your capacity is for for the season you're in and just slowly trim back the hedges trim back the edges so then you can flourish with life in the the things you actually want to do.
And actually want to keep towards or what you could always do is just cut back to create space to then go and explore elsewhere to go and drop seeds of different things that you've been always wanted to do maybe you've wanted to do salsa dancing or stand up or whatever that you've always held back on actually sometimes by creating the space like Dan was saying it's the anticipation that you could go salsa dancing might be enough life to be like.
Actually I'm really enjoying my life it's just the thought that I can do it when I want to do it but I don't want to do it right now and it's just freeing up that evening or morning or whatever um or even just that space to look at it up on YouTube and doing it at home if you don't like groups of people but yeah trim those hedges and figure out those frames sweet thanks so much for watching if you.
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Haven't uh please do because it really helps us continue um to basically build in anticipation which gives us power because we have the right frame in mind see you next week roll the sponsor hello [Music] all right hello anole earpod uthnas Amma I was going to say NASA then um foreign foreign oh do they uncomfortable Daylin dalan Delaney dial is yeah so leaves accordance and a podcast E4 [Laughter] um [Laughter] um um foreign um messy and Pablo guys no that's.
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